Best Med School in England for a student wishing to practice in the USA?

[sheffieldmedic]

I don't think there is any "best" medical school in the UK. Because there is no national curriculum or national assessment, medical schools have all evolved their own ways or teaching and examining medical students. The choice is really about deciding how you learn best, what types of assessment you perform best in etc.

In addition, pick a city where you are going to enjoy your 5 or 6 years as a student.


When all is said and done, every medical student leaves medical school with the MBChB or MBBS. The school we attended doesnt distinguish us as being better than students from the next medical school.

[Gizmo says -]

read the question, macca.

[jabiyasser]

Hey, I've already posted this in another section, but i though since you guys are planning to practice in the USA, you could help me out. I'm from the USA, and want to go to the UK to get a degree (it's a lot faster), take the USMLEs, and come back to the usa for residency and then practice. I'd like to know which med schools focus more attention onto the pure medical sciences instead of stuff like handling patients, hospital procedures, etc. Some med schools focus on the "book work", while others focus on exposure to Uk practice. Basically, it would be pointless to go to a school that primarily focuses on primary care and the UK health system. In short, what are the best schools to go to for people wishing to practice in the usa?? Which schools land students in the best US residencies (Johns Hopkins, Mayo, etc)? Please, I need your help!!

that's exactly what i'm thinking of doing ! but well , i got accepted at Hull york med. school ... ranked 3rd by the Guardian med. schools league ! well ... if u are seeking for aquiring superb clinical skills ! then HYMS should be ur 1st choice !

[sweetie-pie]

sorry to change the subject, but please, league tables actually mean nothing in terms of the education you recieve, dont be fooled by them, only prospective medics and deans of medical schools care.

[Gizmo says -]

on the other hand, the more students apply to the posh prestige unis, the better chance us smal maccas 'ave of getting into a decent one. maybe sweetie we should be encouragig this kind of behaviour?

[Michael]

If your thinking of doing the USMLE then avoid PBL style courses. They do not give you anywhere needed the scientific grounding that Step 1 requires. I am going to Sit the step 1 next year and the amount of work I am having to make up is phenomenal.

As for the differences in style over here vs the US. At least in the US once you get in a residency program, thats it your in, no reapplying for ever decreasing SHO posts or SpR numbers, your in, intern to attending in 8-10 years. Their clinical knoweldge I would say is excellent as well, take a look at the step 1 it tests knowledge far and beyond the UK curriculum. We have US med students rotating in our hospital (4th years) and they make even the brightest students look like muppets.

With the future of the Dr in the NHS looking increasing more crap and application for NHS foundation posts becoming more fierce, mumblings within the BMA realm that the head of NHS is now saying that we were never once "guaranteed" a job upon qualification and it all looks a bit bleak.

[nas007bond]

hey,

there is no comparison between the USA/Canadian madical degrees and UK ones. USA is a leader in medical innovation techniques/technologies etc, and like the above poster mentioned, US medical students can take the 'piss' out of UK ones. Make no mistake about this. This trend is also similar in other degrees in USA too. Just look at what you have to revise for to pass USMLE, like the above poster, the knowledge base required is immense.

About the diminishing SHO posts and ever decreasing SpR numbers, well the SHO level is being phased out. There wont be such a thing as an SHO doctor in the NHS etc. SpR numbers are decreasing because there is NO need for specialists in certain areas. Take for example, cardiothoracis surgery, some thing like 80 SpRs were produced recently and not even one became a consultant surgeon, why? because all the current posts are occupied. Similary some one has to give way and retire before a fresh doctor can take his/her post. And if there arent many consultants retiring, then no one will get promoted even with a CCST will they?

The way forward is to produce consultant/specialists in areas where there is a high demand, and not train people in all specialities just for the sake of it. Progression into specialities should be based by a ranking system, a bit like other countries for example Spain. If you fall in the top x percentage (determined by MRCPs etc) then you get the training posts etc. Its a simple concept.

Lastly, about the job guarantee. The best and most talaneted students (academically and clinically) will get jobs in the end, make no mistake about this. Those that will suffer, will be those with patchy knowldge of the MBBS degree, with the lowest marks etc. At the end of the day, if you pass your final year, you get your MBChB, but are all those student-to-be-doctors the same? Hell no! Some barely scrape through with a pass and others pass with (gold?) medals etc.

When there was a shortage of doctors, even the weakest of students got jobs (because they passed the finals). In the future, it may not be so simple and as easy as that. If doctors are produced in surplus to the requirements, then they will simply relocate abroad - Auss, USA, Canada, and some even in arab states.

[alicia123]

there are a lot of canadian students on the course at nottingham.
i would say its a great course as it does focus on the scientific aspect whilst integrating the clinical side too.

my friend was talking to a registrar in london a few days ago and he said that there is a division arising in UK medical schools. apparently there is becoming a "top group" and "lower group" - basically a split between modern and more traditional courses. graduates from schools such as BSMS, peninsula and HYMS (mainly the new or PBL courses) are supposedly far less employable than those from more traditional schools such as nottingham, bristol, oxbridge and newcastle.

i dont know how true this actually is, but speaking to friends at other medical schools, there is a definite difference in workload and difficulty. it seems hard to believe that all graduates will be judged equally.

[Jake]

With regards to the USMLE its definitely possible to take and do, my current house officer took it in her final year of medschool and is due to start a residency in the US in June. The workload on the Warwick 4 year course has been pretty high and intense but she seemed to think that the test was tough but fair and definitely doable. There are a number of people I know in years above who have taken the course and are moving to the US to do a residency, I think as with anything its down to a lot of hardwork and a little bit of luck.

[nas007bond]

Hum, just to expand on the difference between non-american/candian medical students and american/candian ones in terms of the medical licensing tests:

USMLE Step 1: (http://www.usmle.org/scores/2005perf.htm):

Breifly:

2005: American/Candian medical schools granting MD
> 18,290 examinees : 92% passed
> first takers (16,799) : 94% passed.
> repeaters 1,491 : 72% passed.

Now onto the interesting part: Examinees from Non-US/Canadian Schools

13,488 took part1 : 68% passed
repeaters (5,911) : 39% passed

Look at the figures, 92% and 68% there is such a difference. Also, compare the number of repeaters (1,491 and 72% passed) and just under haf of overseas repeated (5,911) and 39% passed.

What a joke (for step 1).

Things look better for step 2 comparisson. Where first timers (USA/Canada) = 93% and overseas = 77%. Respectable. Step 3 looks even better, 96% for usa/canadians and 83% for non-american/candians.

Am I correct in thinking that in USA/Canada one has to take step 3 of USMLE every 5 years to continue being licenced?

In reality though, patient care is of equal quality here, thats what matters. Just look at the world renowned physician/surgeons working in Harley Street!