Life as a surgeon...

[CluelessJones]

Hoping some people can help with some questions...

Is surgery still the 60 hour a week slog till u get to surgeon level?
What do you really end up earning on the way up to and at the top?
Also is it still possible to combine NHS work with private? What would a working week look like if you did?
Last question! What happens with maxfax trainees? Obv. 9 years medicine/dentistry, do you then do F1 F2 and ST? Do you get any extra pay? Or do you only earn 20k as a 29 year old F1?

Any answers would be great! Thanks CJ

[dsn]

Is surgery still the 60 hour a week slog till u get to surgeon level?

Depends. I think looking at weekly hours is a bit pointless as it will vary a lot depending on the rota and what you're doing.

I know a couple of regs who had three 24 hour on calls plus a 12 hour day shift in one week, which works out at 84 hours (although you can expect to get a few hours sleep on on-calls).

Having said that, staffing issues aside I don't see why your official working hours in surgery as a trainee would be greatly different to those for medics. But possibly surgery trainees are more likely to be in hospital outside of official hours than medics to get theatre time, which is pretty crucial.

I'm told if you want to do surgery, you should really want it.

What do you really end up earning on the way up to and at the top?

Don't know really. I guess it would be the same as anyone else on your grade regardless of speciality, but with supplements depending on out of hours work, on calls etc.

Also is it still possible to combine NHS work with private? What would a working week look like if you did?

I think only consultants ever do private work. Their schedules are quite different to junior doctors as rather than rotas, consultants usually work a set number of sessions (i.e. half days) doing various things (theatre, OPD etc) plus on-calls. So you can do sessions privately in addition to your NHS sessions. Again, I wouldn't know all the detail.

[CluelessJones]

Thanks, getting theatre time? Is that building up a required number of hours before progression, or just being there of ur own volition to get (unpaid) experience?

[Clarkey]

The Royal College of Surgeons has spoken out about the European Working Time Directive because they are worried that reduced numbers of hours will lead to inadequate training for future surgeons. Even if legally they are allowed to work 48 hours a week, many feel that it will take more for them to be at a level where they can safely perform operations. You can google it to find out more.

Don't know the answers to your other questions!

[wanabanana]

Thanks, getting theatre time? Is that building up a required number of hours before progression, or just being there of ur own volition to get (unpaid) experience?

Experience mainly, all trainees are required to keep a log of all operations carried out/assisted in etc. There is a minimum requirement but as far as I'm aware the vast majority would want to go above the minimum to be a good surgeon