Hi I'm new and need advice

[georgiegirl]

Hi All

I'm very inspired by a lot of the posts on this forum. I want to introduce myself and get any advice possible.

I'm George, I'm 36 and a mum of daughters aged 6 and 4, both now at primary school. I have been a SAHM since I was 7 months pregnant with the elder one. I started a law conversion course when she was a baby, a part time 2 year course, evening lectures. I did the end of first year exams when I was 7 1/2 months pregnant with no. 2, and passed well (merit, missed distinction by 2%). I deferred the second year for 2 years then decided law wasn't for me and didn't go back. It was a hard decision after the study I had done and the money it cost, but I had no regrets then and don't now.

Since my younger daughter started school in Jan, I have been contemplating my future. I had been looking forward to the free time, but was bored out of my skull almost immediately. I have spent the last 4 years thinking about what to do with the rest of my life.

It's frightening, but I have come to the conclusion that the only thing I would really, passionately want to do is medicine.

My background at school was slightly dysfunctional. My elder sister is a brilliant scientist and is only 11 months older than me. I was constantly compared with her at school by my teachers and as a consequence made all my decisions based upon wanting to not be compared - ie to be completely different. Until I was 14 I was an all-rounder - good at arts and sciences - but after that I became v. rebellious, stopped working, was put on report, etc. I could wing it in arts subjects, but you can't do that in sciences... So I got As in English Lang and Lit at O Level, Bs in Maths, Geography and Sociology, and Cs in French and History. No science qualifications because I flunked them completely.

I went into sixth form, but ended up dropping out before Christmas and going to work in a health food shop.

One year later I returned to education and went to the local FE college. I did A levels in English, History and History of Art. I got the past papers for the Oxford entrance exam and studied for it off my own bat - worked really hard - applying to do English. I got offered two E grades, got AAA at A level and studied English at Oxford, emerging in 1993 with an upper second.

(In the meantime my sister did medicine at Cambridge, got the second highest 1st in the University... she became a consultant pathologist at 31 and is now 37).

It has taken me a long time to accept and acknowledge, but more than anything I want to be a doctor. There are a lot of paths I could take at this stage, but I know that nothing else would satisfy me in the same way. I feel that life is too short not to give it a shot, but also that life is very long if you are not doing what you really want to - does this make sense?

I know that I have a good academic record, which will be helpful, but I have NO science qualifications. I am willing to bust a gut to try and get myself into contention, but I feel I have a lot of obstacles and want to work out the best way to overcome them.

Thanks for bearing with me during this long message. If you have got this far, can you give me any advice on the following issues....?

1) Am I just completely mad, or does anyone think I stand a chance given my situation?

2) The Access to Medicine Course in Kings Lynn is a 2 hour commute away. Is this commute feasible, given the demands of the course, or should I try and do some science A levels - does anyone have any experience of this or anything similar? Or should I try for med schools that will accept people without science qualifications, via GAMSAT for example?

3) I live in N Herts, a 35 minute commute into London Kings Cross. My husband refuses to move. This is very limiting. Does anyone on this forum face a similar commute into a London med school, and what's it like?

4) Is this totally unfair on my kids and husband? How do others make it work?

5) Can anyone, anywhere give me any ideas about how realistic my dreams of becoming a doctor might be?

6) Another point worth mentioning is that my husband commutes into London. He often has to work long hours, but I'm thinking I could maybe get an au pair.

Thanks for reading. In the meantime I plan to get voluntary work at the local hospital (in Stevenage).

I am so full of admiration for those of you who are doing this already.


George x

[louise colette]

George you sound amazing and just the sort of accomplished, rounded person that medicine needs... I'll try to answer your questions in order, but I'm one of many who'll be pleased to help so I'm sure you'll get lots of other posts winging their way to you too!
Oh, and don't worry about age because I'm 34...

1. I think you stand a very good chance of getting into medicine, BUT as you've already recognised you'll need to get some solid work experience behind you. It seems to me that this is what makes the difference between invitation to interview and outright rejection. Could your sister help you with this?

2. I'm on the King's Lynn access course at the moment. People certainly do commute from London (and other places), but it's worth pointing out that in my seminar group it seems to have been those very people who struggled most. Indeed some of them have now left the course (both of their own volition and at the college's request).
It's certainly a good course, but you may find if you choose wisely that you don't need either that or science A levels. It just depends on which course you choose. Foe example I've been lucky enough to be offered an unconditional place at Newcastle and therefore the access course has played no part at all. However, if you've got a year to play with - like I did last year - then it's probably worth doing something anyway. Particularly if you're considering GAMSAT. I took GAMSAT, so if you want any info please feel free to PM me.
Not sure that I'm answering this very well! Basically, you should try to do as much as you can to increase your chances. This is why I did GAMSAT and an access course etc. This seems to be a better path than A levels, but obviously your circumstances may make this harder.

3. I'll leave someone else to answer this!

4. I have neither husband nor kids and I'm sure you're the best person to answer this, but I don't think it's unfair. There'll never be a perfect time to take the leap, but there are plenty of women (and men) on my course with young families.

5. Entirely realistic I would say - there'll be heaps of people reading your thread who are, or have been, in a similar situation to you. Academically it seems that you would be a very strong candidate and medicine is actively trying to take people from more diverse backgrounds, so I'm sure that you would be considered seriously.

Good luck with pursuing your dreams. It's taken me years to finally take the plunge, but I'm very glad that I have.

Feel free to PM me with any questions x

[tinsel]

Hey,
I think you would stand a chance too and i think you should go for it as you may regret it otherwise. I agree with above, i'm not convinced such a long commute would work, and you would probably best consider moving.
I think also that GAMSAT would be very very hard with no science background. I did it once and i have science a-levels and a science degree but i still had to put in fair bit of practic. Although in the end it was the humanities part of the paper than let me down (and you'll probably excel in this).
You may be better off cramming in A-level bio and chem, which you could do locally.
I think the best thing to do would be to contact the unis that you want to go to and ask them directly. A few years ago i heard of someone who did really well (very high score) in the humanities section of the GAMSAT, but didn't do well enough in the sciences to get interview (can't remeber where) but they did interview her and she was offered place on the condition that she took a-level chem. So occasionally unis are a bit flexible with their criteria. But you realy need to speak with admissions.
Good luck

[Lizzie-Beth]

Hi George - I was a similar age when I decided to look into applying for medicine. I had four A-levels in arty subjects, one O-level in French and I hadn't been in a science lab for 20 years.

So to answer your questions as best I can ...
1: No I don't think you're mad (although most of my friends decided I was, I went ahead nevertheless ...!) and I was in a "worse" position than you, having no degree or anyway of proving that I had the stamina to last the course.

2: I think a 2 hour commute is too much (personally) especially with a young family. At the moment I drive to Leicester each day (about an hour and a half) and it's exhausting and I don't have a husband or family. I think the A-level route is best. I did chemistry and biology A-level part-time (and physics GCSE for good measure!)

3: The commute to London sounds far more tolerable - I don't know about travelling within central London, but if it's on a par with what I do (or probably less) then it's certainly do-able.

4: I don't think anyone can really judge on how fair it is on your family. I think anyone embarking on this route who has commitments has to really have the support of their partner - because it is draining and very time consuming. As long as your husband is aware of the changes you're both going to have to make and he's willing to support you in it, I think you have every chance of making it work. I have a partner of 17 years and we've had to completely change our lifestyle ... if you're good at managing your time (which you clearly are) and you consider getting an au-pair to help with the logistics of everything, I'm sure you could work things out. It's not easy (although my bf is understanding, he still gets a little grumpy from time to time!) but as long as you both go into it with your eyes open, it should work out eventually!

5: I think your ambitions are very realistic. If I were you I would contact the schools which are a realistic commute and ask them what academic requirements they would have, based on your existing qualifications and experience. Then I would get as much work experience as I could and look into A-level courses at your local college. I agree with the above poster who said GAMSAT would be a bit of a mountain with no science qualifications ... it may seem like a long way around doing A-levels, but you can do them in a year at most colleges and it would give you time to get your application together and hunt around for someone to write you a good reference.

Time really goes quickly - it doesn't seem five minutes since I was trying to decide if I had any chance of getting into med school or if I had actually lost the plot completely .... and now I'm coming to the end of my second year!

Best of luck - let me know if you have any questions
x

[midnite-oil]

Hi George

I haven't time for a long post, and can only tell you about my experience. I commute to my closest med school, but it's an hour and a half minimum door to door, sometimes over 2 hours coming home. It's pretty full on, and I do virtually no housework/ cooking etc, as all spare time is either working or spending time with children. I am on a GEP course though, so the pace would be slower on a 5 year if you can afford it. I couldn't do it without lots of help from my husband. (No other family around) However, if yours isn't able to help much, could you afford nanny, au-pair, cleaner? Doing a degree is not supposed to be any harder than a fulltime job, and plenty of people seem to manage to juggle both partners working in London. There can also be more flexibilty, afternoons off etc which you could use to pick up kids. In practice I am rarely seen at the school gate, which has been hard for me in a way as I was also SAHM for 10 years, so I'm a bit cut off from my old life / children's friends etc.

Some people on our course stay over a few nights in the week. Maybe you could apply for Kings Lynn and have a couple of nights up there cramming in the work? 2 hours commute is about on the limit I'd say. I leave at 7.15am for a 9 am start, and if we finish at 5pm, I don't get back until 6.45. It can be quite exhausting, but I am finding more stamina than I expected. Motherhood is good preparation!

Pm me if you like. Lots of people on this site helped me when I was thinking of applying, so if I can add anything else I'd be happy to help.


Good Luck!

midnite-oil

[cakelover]

Sorry to be brief, cooking supper! Don't forget the 6 year courses that include science. I did one on those. My husband also refused to move, but I applied anyway. He changed his mind - we moved countries! So you can cross that bridge if you have places. Commuting is hard going, especially if you are doing clinical. My girls were 6 and 4 when I started and I was 34. I'm in year 3 of a 6 year course and time has simply flown by. I agree with others, get some solid volunteer experience behind you and make your application stellar.

PM too, if you have any questions.
Link for 6 year courses http://www.chms.ac.uk/schools/foundation_courses.htm

[Gizmo says -]

the madder u are, the easier it wil be to get in, Georgie.

[georgiegirl]

Wow, thanks so much for all the advice... I feel quite encouraged. I really appreciate the time and effort that has gone into the replies to my original post.

I like the idea of the Kings Lynn course, because it's so focused on the objective, but I think deep down I know it's not going to be feasible to me to do such a long commute. I'm fundamentally a night owl, though getting up early with my children has conditioned me a bit the other way.

My husband is supportive, but with reservations. We moved out of London nearly three and a half years ago, because we couldn't find an affordable house near acceptable schools. It was all a bit of an accident really but it's worked out well - we live in Hitchin in Herts now, and my girls love it here. They are at a fantastic state primary and getting on really well there. It took a while to settle and was very hard at first, but we've put roots down here. My husband won't move, full stop. He'd been in London 20 years, so it's amazing I prised him out. Moving again is not an option. I've tried to persuade him that we could move to Cambridge - I love it there and could commute more easily to Kings Lynn - but the house prices are higher than here, we'd have to downshift and he'd have a longer commute. Commuting into London makes him grumpy enough as it it, without adding an extra 15 mins to the journey!

I think I am going to try and do 2 A levels - Biology and Chemistry - in a year, locally. Has anyone done anything like this, and how tough was it?

Lizzie-Beth, your idea to contact schools and ask for advice re what academic qualifications they would require given my current predicament sounds a good one. I will do this and let you know how I get on.

I'm fortunate in that my husband has his own successful business and we are fairly OK financially. In some ways this is an advantage - I can (almost) afford fees and get paid help - but it creates its some problems also. First, one reason we are financially OK is that he is 14 years older than me (now 50! I think I dreaded that birthday more than he did!) and well established in his industry. But he doesn't love his job and his dreams are of retirement, while mine are all focused on having more, not less, to do... He knows I am bored stiff, but it is hard to sell the idea of my future career to him when he is bringing home the bacon. He'd be quite happy for me to just get some little job to keep me occupied, while maintaining our lovely home, cooking great food and ironing his shirts (yawn).

Re work experience, my sister would not help me. She and I love each other but have a complicated and competitive relationship. She is not positive about my current plans. Encouragingly, she thinks I could cope with the science, despite my background in arts. Less positively, she thinks I am not an ideal candidate. She also thinks that medicine is a huge slog and that the rewards at the end are not worth it. I suspect a lot of people who studied medicine as school leavers feel this way, but at 36 I do feel I have my eyes open and have explored and considered enough other options to feel that, for me, it would be worth it. I am trying to keep her reservations in perspective. She is outstandingly bright and quite a tough customer. She thinks that many of the people who studied medicine at Cambridge with her, and some of the doctors she currently works with, are no good, so if she thinks I'm not an ideal candidate I don't take that as too much of a discouragement! She is single and childless, so when she says I lack patience I just think (as a mother) 'you have no idea...!' She and I are each other's harshest critics. I think also maybe she sees medicine as her patch and doesn't like the idea of another doctor in the family.

I revealed my plans to one of my brothers this evening. He was very encouraging. He did a chemistry degree and PhD at Cambridge and now works as a research scientist for a major pharmaceuticals company. He's a new father and sees things in a different way from my sister. Now he knows what it's like having a young baby, he's in awe of how I've managed with my girls.

Louise Colette - why did you do GAMSAT? Did you do it just to get another qualification, or to make yourself more attractive to schools? How did you get the unconditional offer from Newcastle, and what is an unconditional offer exactly? Sorry if I seem ignorant. Do people just do GAMSAT 'on spec' rather than with a view to going to a particular med school? So they can say 'I scored X in GAMSAT'... I had a go at some GAMSAT sample questions which I found online. I managed to get 100% in the humanities bit, which was very encouraging, but it was based on one of my old A Level English texts, which I am sure skewed things enormously!!!!

I would like to PM some of you, but don't know how to do it. Do I need to subscribe to something?

Best wishes

George xx

[blueberrypie]

Hi there. I am in my thirties and am on an access course at lambeth college. We also have people with degrees in non-science subjects and following a successful completion of the course go on to do the four year courses in medicine.

I had a brother who was always the perfect one, you know, I could never possibly be able to perform to his standards. He is very successful, but in computers, and I have now decided to medicine. My father was always very negative, and this resulted in me choosing not to go to school most of the time.

I also have children, I have three children aged 10, 8 & 6 and could never stand being a stay at home mum - I always had to work (home life would drive me nuts). I have found that since they have all been at school, studying is brilliant. I do approximately three and a half days a week at college and on my days off, am able to fit in some 'child-free' studying.

I think you will make an excellent doctor, and although we can turn around and try to go against what you really want, in order to prove people right sometimes, I think it is more important for you to do what you really want.

I have always been a big believer in job satisfaction, and when I started work, I would only ever work in a sector that my brother thought was a dead end job. Well now that experience may have helped me to be in a position to turn around and do what I want to do. It is never too late and it is good to prove people wrong sometimes.

I wish you all the best in your training.

[blueberrypie]

To PM someone, click on their user name and it will give you the option to PM them. No subscription necessary... its not like friends reunited.