Urgent...

[sara7000]

Hi, I have an interview on Tuesday and I still don't understand the training systems Have a few questions, would really be helpful if someone answers them

Are doctors (juniors) jobless after foundation years due to MMC? I am confused as to why would doctors be jobless and consider leaving the profession because they can not get into training posts?

Also in the older system, you spent 3 years as a senior house officer, if you got into training for a specialist registrar then good else what happened? What are career-grade posts?

And now if I study Medicine and say want to be a dermatologist, would I DEFINATELY get into basic medical training for dematology? (Higher specialist training then sub-specialty?) or would I have to enter another training post or would I just be left jobless? Two days before my interview I am actually thinking that I might be jobless even after 5/6 years of medical school?

Thanks

Sara

[rjm]

Essentially you are not guaranteed a job at any time. You are not guaranteed a foundation post on leaving medical school although the chance of you not getting a post anywhere in the country is very slim, bare in mind though that it may not be in your first choice of hospital or even region.

After the 2 year foundation posts you have to apply for specialty training. Competition levels vary depending on what you want to do. I have no idea for dermatology. There are many people who do not get into their choice of specialty for specialty training. Depending on the specialty this may be a 2 or 3 year core training post ie equivalent to the old SHO levels, after which you have to reapply for what is the equivalent of registrar post - again job not guaranteed. In other specialties you get run-through training (ie right up to end of registrar training as long as you meet the assessments/skills throughout training). Many people who dont get training posts will take a short term (6m/1y) post in the specialty and then try again to get into a training post the following year. So it boils down to you are not guaranteed a job in the specialty you want, or anywhere. Realistically though you would probably be able to find a non-training post in something to pay the bills. Many people leave the country because they cannot get the job they want.

So no, you will not definitely get into anything. That is true of all jobs in life, be it medicine or anything else.

[yazoo]

Are doctors (juniors) jobless after foundation years due to MMC? I am confused as to why would doctors be jobless and consider leaving the profession because they can not get into training posts?

I have yet to meet a junior Dr trained in the UK who is jobless after medical school (who didn't choose to be). What the job is and where it is are not so easy to control

Also in the older system, you spent 3 years as a senior house officer, if you got into training for a specialist registrar then good else what happened? What are career-grade posts?

This is essentially now either core training or the early stage of run-through training. In core training, you specialise broadly but within a field of study: e.g. acute care, medicine or surgery... Run-through means you can train from the end of foundation until the end of specialist reg training (as long as you pass all the exams and assessments needed) e.g path, O&G.

And now if I study Medicine and say want to be a dermatologist, would I DEFINATELY get into basic medical training for dematology? (Higher specialist training then sub-specialty?) or would I have to enter another training post or would I just be left jobless?

No. Entry is competitive. And the number of specialty posts are set to fall, while the number of GP posts may rise (if they are funded...). So the odds will be even harder in the future. Not sure by how much, though.

Two days before my interview I am actually thinking that I might be jobless even after 5/6 years of medical school?

At the moment there are plenty of non-training grade = career grade posts around. You don't get the same training and career progression is severely impaired if you stay in this type of job too long. But it is a job.

I think there will become a time that Drs numbers will outstrip demand. There is an option of working abroad. But this is where I disagree a bit with RJM. I don't think people generally go abroad as they can't get a job, I think most go as they want to work overseas. These jobs are much more competitive than they used to be, and many people successfully return to find specialist training posts in the UK.

Basically, I think good medical jobs will be harder to come by in the future for the average Dr. And that the below average may struggle to get a job at all (and maybe this latter part is a good thing).

[thepriceofreality]

I think there will become a time that Drs numbers will outstrip demand.

I don't think this will happen too soon. Surely demand for doctors will increase - ageing population etc - However, I don't think government will be able to fund the increasing numbers of doctors.