questions about UK medical schools (coming from US)

[RaaD]

i'm from the states, and here's my situation (pretty long, if you don't have time, just skip to my bolded questions ):

graduated from high school a few years back

did nothing for a while, picked up some steam in 2003 and decided on a major this past spring. unfortunately, its a new major, and i'm only at about 60 credits so far, and need 110-120 to graduate (*if* i get into the classes i need, that puts me out in fall of '06). the problem is classes and sessions/sections of them are few and far inbetween. in fact, the biology and chemistry departments frequently spar over new courses to be taught...btw, this is the Bioscience major.

my problem is my grades aren't too hot in my first few classes here and now i can't do anything about it...i don't want to waste any more time. i can and will do fine in all future classes, but i'd like to keep my options open.

i took the MCAT in august and got a 30R (8P-9B-13V), without really taking Organic Chemistry (no semesters), but i had 1 semester of Physics, 2 of General Chemistry, and 1 of Biology (the 2nd, skipped the first...because of that school's lack of classes). i was also recovering from a surgery gone awry... so my list of excuses is long i'm planning on preparing properly and taking it again in April...i could hit mid-30s, or higher if i need to, and i'm guessing i need to?

So to cut my biography down to appropriate forum post size...will UK schools be a possible alternative for me? What are some schools in UK and how do they rank compared to each other and to US schools, and what paths do they offer for US students (i will probably want to practice back here i guess)...links would be great, i'd like to check out some admission requirements. Do any require a certain number of credits, rather than completed undergraduate degrees from US applicants?

i will find places to volunteer in the meantime. I'd rather avoid the carribean or asian schools...and everybody speaks english in the UK and flights are under $500 round trip so that's a bonus

I am pretty confident in an interview situation (i guess volunteering will help with that), but i don't know what UK schools place an emphasis on. grades, interview, or test scores (MCAT)? in my case i guess i should hope the MCAT matters a lot because of my inexperience and lackluster GPA? Money is really not an issue...this is about the only thing my parents support me in.

[RaaD]

sorry, in my haste i didn't notice the 'International Students' forum

if a mod could move the thread...

[S.Rahman]

Do any require a certain number of credits, rather than completed undergraduate degrees from US applicants?

But i don't know what UK schools place an emphasis on. grades, interview, or test scores (MCAT)? in my case i guess i should hope the MCAT matters a lot because of my inexperience and lackluster GPA? Money is really not an issue...this is about the only thing my parents support me in.

Hey,

Unfortunately I can't answer most of your questions seeing as how I'm a 2006 hopeful, and not yet a med student. What I do know is what I've been told by Canadians who have already gotten in.

You don't need an undergrad degree, unlike here I'm in second year right now and I'm applying... I wish I'd done it right out of highschool though!

From what I've been told (but be forwarned that this is not usually your best source... your best bet would be to get up at 5 AM lol and call the UK med schools yourself) there isn't any ONE thing in particular that emphasis is placed upon... of course there will be an emphasis on grades, but that should also be balanced out by your extracurricular activities, volunteer work, etc. And depending on the institution there may or may not be an interview... I'm an interview kinda person myself so I avoided applying to med schools that don't do interviews. MCAT... I don't think they require it? some do... some also require the BMAT (oxford, cambridge.. I think)

PLUS, if your GPA isn't all that great sometimes it's due to factors outside of your control, such as a personal or family crisis..... they know you're only human, and they understand that, so that can be talked about in your personal statement.

Anyway, I know this wasn't of much help but then again I'm kind of living in a haze too nowadays! praying for interviews! Good luck with everything

-S.R

[RaaD]

so they just require a GPA, extracurrics and basically an interview? :O that must get really competitive if they don't have a standardized test to 'filter out' people like they do here (though thats pretty evil). do they require SAT/ACT for their undergrad programs? (i believe those are 5 or 6-year? as opposed to 4 year postgraduate)

thanks for the help

[S.Rahman]

Nope, no SAT's for the 5-year either

[Fizzwizz]

Hi Raad
If I can speak candidly I think that, for whatever reasons, you feel your application for medschool in the US is going to be weak due to your grades and that you would like an alternative should you be unsuccessful.

Medicine here in the UK is highly competitive, and given the 6:1 application ratio I would think your chances of acceptance are probably less than in the US.

Also, if you were fortunate enough to get a place you would not be able to practice in the US without taking the UCMLE exams and then finding a residency which I am told are scarce for students graduating outside the US

It's hard for me to advise you further as I am not in touch with the US system but here in the UK there are few opportunities for students with lower grades. The graduate entry programs here expect high degree classes and are organised to bring new skills to medicine and not to give a route into medicine for lower grades.

A link that will help you with minimum academic qualification is http://www.ucas.ac.uk/

you can use the course search to search for Medicine. UCAS is the organisation you have to apply through.

The standars in UK med schools are very high, and I hear they compare well to the US. I've been told that the main difference is that in the US medics rely on test results more where UK Docs have stronger clinical examination skills. I think this is due to the cost of tests here.

I would be VERY cautious about alternative Med schools in the Caribean and Asia. I've heard some scary stories.

Thread moved to Int forum

Good luck ... Fizz

[heed]

Hi Raad
I would be VERY cautious about alternative Med schools in the Caribean and Asia. I've heard some scary stories.
Good luck ... Fizz

also, dont be tempted to apply to "private" medical schools in the UK. Five of them had their accreditation with the General Medical Council withdrawn last week for being crap (basically).

[RaaD]

wow thanks for all the information, very helpful.

fizz: thanks for the advice. i guess i had better get my GPA up well over a 3.5 then. in your experience, would you say UK schools in their interviews or anywhere in the application process are more understanding of gpa fluctuations (provided of course, the final average is good). the schools i was looking to apply to here are not at all forgiving. even if someone was applying with a 3.8 to 3.9 with great standardized test scores, just showing ANY weakness could mean you're out of luck.

the one i was looking at in particular was Oxford, as an alternative to my first two choices here Harvard or Columbia. i didn't know they were that miffed by applications from US schools? does anyone have any more specific information with regards to Oxford... i can meet the requirements of the US schools, but because of my personal case, its obviously a reach. it also hurts because i just decided on this course last year, so while i'm rushing to finish up my undergrad, i don't have the time i'd like to do work at hospitals which would help shore up my applications.

and going to school in the UK would be more convenient for me than going to school in some rural area of the US (mainly anything aside from the northeast). i have some distant family there, all my friends do too, and its the stopover route to Pakistan, where my sister is in her first year of medical school (she's 20), and visiting each other no longer becomes a 18 hour $1500 endeavour.

of course beggars can't be choosers, but if i'd had to "settle" for a school, i think there's a few more attractive choices in the UK than in the northeastern US.

[lollipop]

Hi,

Somebody said this already... The UK is not an 'alternative' for people who fail to get into med school in the US. You also say that you wish to practise in the US later on, so the UK (other than for tourism and a few "family" reasons) isn't actually a destination for you.
International (non-EU) students are being accepted and welcomed, but mostly for "positive" reasons, like lack of medical education in their home countries, specialized in-depth research interests/expertise, etc. They are not "ouch, I screwed my GPA up, where can I go now?" types. If you hadn't the "GPA-issue", you wouldn't be thinking of studying in the UK, right?

What school are you at now? This factors in, esp. if you need to explain your current/past academic record.

All the best, and good luck applying.

[m00ple]

Mate, I wouldn't bother applying to Oxford if you're hoping that it will be easier to get into than your preferred US schools. In fact, I reckon you would be wasting your time with just about every med school in the UK. As lollipop says, the UK schools don't look favourably upon people who think they screwed up their chances in the US so want to try their chances here, and many of the UK schools are as good/better than US schools so the competition is unlikely to be lower here.