Cambridge or Imperial?

[Gizmo says -]

Originally Posted by MA86

Without wanting to be biased, as someone in his third year of med at Imperial I can only speak accurately about my views on Imperial.

well i gotta agree wif that macca. amen.

1) Patient Contact. Imperial throws you into patient contact from day 1 at med school.

but so does cambridge -

Originally Posted by cambridge website

Students spend three weeks at Addenbrooke’s on the Introductory Course. They meet their Clinical Supervisors who will support them as a member of a small, stable group, throughout the clinical course

Originally Posted by impy

You visit many GPs over your time in the first year so that you can get to know the dynamics of patient-doctor relationship. This will help to gradualy increase your confidence and ability to speak properly to patients by your 4 week attachment in year 2.

but so do cambridge.... they ave early clinicals during all terms in years 1,2 and 3. -

Originally Posted by cambridgey

Stage 1- Clinical Method – 6 months
Stage 1 objectives are achieved by integration of curriculum themes with clinical material. Students are supported in moving into the clinical environment and towards self-directed, experiential learning. They begin their personal and professional development through exploration of ethical dilemmas, through examining students’ own attitudes and values and via an appreciation of the patients’ perspective of illness.

Medicine and Surgery Placements – 4 x 5 weeks: Students are attached to medical or surgical firms either at Addenbrooke’s or at one of six regional hospitals (Bedford, Hinchingbrooke, Ipswich, Kings Lynn or Peterborough). Each student rotates through Cambridge Medicine / Cambridge Surgery / Regional Medicine / Regional Surgery. Students go to the same hospital for both regional placements. During these placements, students experience General Medicine, General Surgery Care of the Elderly and an introduction to Acute Care.

Seminar programme: in the mornings during Medicine and Surgery placements, in the mornings students focus on clinical work and are encouraged to clerk patients and follow them up, including attending appropriate investigations. In the afternoons, there is a seminar programme for the entire student cohort, enabling all students to cover the same topic area week by week. Seminars are integrated between different specialties and combine to address all curricular themes. Distance learning materials replace some seminar teaching for students on Regional placements.

Primary Care – 8 days: groups of four students are attached to two general practices: wherever possible one close to Addenbrooke’s and one close to their Regional teaching hospital. During each five week placement, students spend two days in their local host practice, seeing patients with conditions relevant to that week’s topic area and seeing patients in opportunistic surgeries.

Review and Integration Weeks 1- 3: Pathology teaching occupies approximately 2.5 days of each of these weeks. Three other courses start in weeks 1 - 3 and run through the R & I programme to the end of Stage 3. “Frontiers in Medicine” showcase the excellent translational and clinical research being undertaken on the Addenbrooke’s campus by members of the Clinical School and partner research organisations. There is a series of guest lectures around the subject of “Humanities in Medicine”, with invited speakers from the wider University setting and beyond. “The Patient’s Voice” enables a set of expert patients to meet the students and discuss their experiences of the health service and their illness.

Stage 1 Portfolio: Students develop a portfolio based on patients that they have seen including case write-ups and pieces relating to the various curricular themes.

Stage 2 - Life Course - 10 months

This course comprises five x 8-week placements based on the stages of human lifespan:

Growth, Development and Childhood Illness

Women’s Health

Major Adult Diseases (Cardio-thoracic medicine, Oncology, Infectious Disease, GU Medicine)

Neurosciences, Rheumatology and Orthopaedics

Psychiatry
Hospital Placements

Students are based in regional hospital locations for between 6 and 18 weeks. In each placement, students are attached to a relevant specialist hospital firm with coordinated input from other specialists representing the curricular themes.

Primary and Community Care, 4 x two weeks: Students spend the last two weeks of four of the Life Course placements studying General Practice and Community Care. Students learn about the relevant specialty in primary care and the community, as well as primary care overall within the curricular themes. Students are placed in groups of four, relating to a single practice throughout the Stage. In each fortnight, students spend one week attached to a general practice in which they see patients, work with allied health professionals and gather data for later presentation. They also spend one week in small groups, undertaking student-directed learning related to community-based clinical scenarios. They explore the realities of living with illness in the community including meeting with community-based careers and organisations. At the end of each of the four two-week periods, students give an assessed presentation.


Review and Integration Weeks 4 - 8: all students cover the same material, irrespective of the topic addressed in their previous placement addressed. Pathology teaching occupies approximately 1.5 days of each of each week. The “Frontiers in Medicine”, and “Humanities in Medicine” and “Patients’ Voice” courses continue.

Portfolio: Students continue to assemble their portfolio based on patients that they have seen. This includes case write-ups and pieces relating to the various curricular themes. In particular, students identify patients with different cancers and with cardiovascular disease to form the basis of the reflective portfolio.

2) Year 3 will rotate you again over 3 * 10 week attachments in different hospitals so that you get to experience different types of hospitals and how they are run.

yay so do ....you can quote the rest yaself mind hehe

3) Imperials dominance over major teaching/research hospitals in london includes St Marys, CharingX, Chelsea & Westminister as well as 7 other DGHs scattered around North West London. By in large as a medical school it unarguably has the best clinical & teaching facilities that is led by some of the best NHS practitionars. So much so that Imperial leads the UK's first Acedamic Health Science Centre (AHSC) which is modelled on a similar ground to the prestigious John Hopkins institute in the US. This is very important in an era where we increasingly advance medicine by implementing research in a clinical basis.

so, ow is this an advantage for a student who moves to imperial after three years in cambridge, if you figure in that there no way you can benefit from even a fraction of all the ospitals you mention in your 'pre-clinical' years?

4) By the time Oxbridge students join Imperial they would have done 3 years of basic sciences (they qualify with a BA before they join) that the difference in how oxbridge vs imperial students interact with patients in a clinical context is quite marked.

given the abuv, that they get about the same clinical exposure - why? i fink the one fing you can say about imps is that your course was restructured for integration clinix/pre-clinix in 1998, Cambridge's in 2000. not really much of an 'eadstart though., is it?

Whilst some may say that will resolve over time, speaking to final years the edge in experience stays with the imperial students upto qualif...

ok, we've covered that....

In summary with my rather short promotion of Imperial, I would say it definitely is an excellent faculty with no complaints. The support structure and Student Union at Imperial are great and organise good events with something for everyone.

the main difference between cambridge and imperial that you've not covered is only the much igher cost of living in london.
Cambridger pays £4.00 to go to a decent pictures, you pay £8-00. dubble pricing in everyfing, but only a 20% increase in loan available. now theres a difference you'll feel.



Definitely choose Imperial![/quote]

[wannabe Dr]

Originally Posted by Pammy

I do believe that you have to have done pretty well if you want to transfer to Cambridge from anywhere else...
I'd always do it the other way round though! Benefit from Cambridge's amazing pre-clinical course, and then make use of the opportunities London has to offer for clinical (many more hospitals, larger variety of patients, etc)!
Pammy

I agree with Pammy. 3 years pre-clinical at Cambridge (not many have mentioned the unique advantages that the oxbridge collegiate system offers), and then 3 years clinical in London (Imperial/UCL/GKT). You get the best of both worlds

[Singh.Simran]

And, if preclin is at cambridge, your intercalated degree cam be in anything. So you're free to explore intellectually rather than doing some vaguely related science course. Though course you can do that too.

[Gizmo says -]

tbf, Simran, u can do a lorra arts courses in your bsc in london unis if one looks ard enuff.

i mean, whoever fort you culd do sanskrit at georgies?

[Singh.Simran]

Originally Posted by Gizmo says -

tbf, Simran, u can do a lorra arts courses in your bsc in london unis if one looks ard enuff.

i mean, whoever fort you culd do sanskrit at georgies?

well ya learn something new every day...

[TaChYcArDiA]

Pick Imperial...the person who posted above just demonstrates exactly what people at oxbridge are like and DON'T let others tell you otherwise!

[Pammy]

Originally Posted by TaChYcArDiA

Pick Imperial...the person who posted above just demonstrates exactly what people at oxbridge are like and DON'T let others tell you otherwise!

Which person are you referring to...and how would you describe them? Curious!

[Singh.Simran]

Oh and since i've now looked them up, what you can do as an iBsc at imperial appears to be:

Medical Sciences with one of:
* Cardiovascular Sciences
* Endocrinology
* Gastroenterology and Hepatology
* Haematology
* Immunity and Infection
* Management
* Neurosciences and Mental Health
* Reproductive and Developmental Sciences
* Respiratory Science
* Surgery and Anaesthesia

Humpf. I'd rather something different to the other half-decade, tbh.

[adi]

Originally Posted by TaChYcArDiA

Pick Imperial...the person who posted above just demonstrates exactly what people at oxbridge are like and DON'T let others tell you otherwise!

Wow - that's a little harsh! Are we to equally presume from your post that being judgemental and generalising excessively is "what people at Imperial are like"? No, because that would be falling prey to the same argumentative flaw, but still - your comment's a little bit extreme, don't you think?!

[conservativepassion]

cambridge by far

you can spend 3 years living in cambridge - and live a life of a normal student


then spend 3 years in london (ucl or imperial...or oxford!) and experience a life as a medical student!