Army Medical Cadetship

[cakeman]

Can anyone tell me a little more about the medical cadetship, I've looked at the army website but was wondering if anyone knew anything more.

[?dentist?]

Cakeman, I've been meaning to start a thread like this for ages but kept not getting round to it. I'm interested in navy cadetships poss for dentistry!
I know someone who has a cadetship with the navy for medicine. It's pretty good cos he can do his FY1 and FY2 in a military hospital (from what I've heard sometimes they are public hospitals specialising also in the forces...). If you are accepted onto the busary then you will be expected to join the OTC at your uni if there is one though I dont think they expect you to attend all the time as medicine is work heavy. You get a LARGE bursary (and fees paid i think) for the final 3 years of the course but if you leave medicine or the army before your owed 7ish years of working for them (i think 7, not sure if included foundation years) are up you have to repay some or all of the money. Within the army the opportunities to do extra courses and gain knew skills are huge, supposedly. I'd really like to be in the forces in a medical role but not sure my personality suits.
Would be good if there was someone on this site actually with a cadetship as like you I mainly know what is on the website....

[Hal100]

Looking at Army Medical Cadetship beginning from Year 3 of Medical School....

How competetive is it to enter?
Would I be correct in thinking that, if accepted, cadets can do their F1 and F2 years in NHS hospitals or Defence hospitals and are from then on required to serve with the army for 6 years (i.e. instead of spending ST1-6 years in hospitals, they are instead spent with the army)?
During the 6 years, are cadets able to undertake relevant postgraduate qualifications with their career direction in mind (i.e. MRCP, FRCA, FRCS etc)?
Would I be correct in thinking that, if after 6 years in the army and gaining a CCST, army medics could easily go into NHS civilian practice as consultants in their relavent specialties??

Any help/advice on the above points or any other information on Army, RAF or Navy cadetship would be great

Cheers

[yazoo]

We had a number of cadets in my year, the majority did FY1 and 2 in the NHS and are just about to head off to officer training.

I think people fall mainly into 2 groups - those who really want to join the forces and do medicine, and those who think it sounds quite exciting and are seeking the financial sponsorship. The latter group are fine if they have an idea about what medical career they wish to enter, but it's more of a problem for those who might just love paeds or O&G. One wants to do paeds, but plans on doing this after leaving the army - they will still only be about 30 so loads of time.

The other thing to remember is that transtion to civilian life after may be made more difficult by the limited range of experience that may be available within the forces (you will be dealing mainly with fit young adults with acute health problems or those who are injured). This will matter more for some career paths than others, and may affect your attractiveness to the NHS despite being fully trained.

I think very careful reseach is required before making a decision.

NB I have no personal insight, so the above is just word of mouth.

[Hughman]

I don't think a stint in the Forces will restrict you that much. You'll be in a far better position for intensive/acute medical posts like A&E, trauma, intensive care and surgery. They do say that Sandhurst is one of the best manager training institutes in the world.

Personally I might go for the RAF - but I do need to improve my fitness (and they may not like the fact I had asthma when I was younger)

[Riffraf]

Just to answer a few questions...

The main downsides of Service life are that you will get sent where the Service needs you and this may not be where you want to go. That said, they won't deliberately mess you around and if your preference to go somewhere matches a vacancy you'll generally (but not always!) get it. In all three Services you will get sent on ops/exercises overseas on a relatively regular basis, and you could expect to spend - very roughly - an average of 6-8 weeks away each 12-18 months (at current op tempo) depending on your stage in training and speciality. In terms of choice of Service, each have their own pros and cons some of which are fairly obvious (e.g. don't join the Navy if you get sea sick and never want to see a ship). Some differences are more subtle and you'd need to research it carefully; for example, your choice of speciality may have a large bearing on your choice of Service, as there are differences in what is available and how long it will take you to train.

In terms of sponsorship and pay, each of the three Services has a similar sponsorship (and identical pay) scheme. For the final 3 years of uni you can apply for a cadetship that will pay you a salary and pay your fees (pensionable in case you are really thinking ahead!). You will be expected to serve typically 6 years after F1 if you take the full package, and would need to pay back some money if you decided to leave before that (but you won't be made to stay if you are unhappy). Sponsorship starts starts around 14k in the first year of sponsorship rising to about 17.5k in your final year at uni. Sometimes, bursaries worth about 4k are available as well for the first/second years at uni if you are sure that early that the military is for you. F1 pay is about 39k, F2 about 51K, accredited newly qualified GP starts around 64K, rising to 91k after 2ish years thereafter and then roughly 2kish more every year thereafter (114k max). Consultants start on slightly lower salaries but ultimately may earn more (124k max). You can also get further excellence awards/GP Trainer allowances etc that may raise that a bit further, and you may be able to do some private work. You will also get your postgrad accreditation fees paid and a non-contributory final salary pension. If you are already fully trained, the Services are offering "Golden Hellos" of 50k for some specialities at the moment in return for committing to a certain period of service. So the money is quite good, at least in the early years.

With regards to how you do your clinical training, if you go for a hospital speciality you will generally train (and then often work as a consultant) in an MoD Hospital Unit attached to an NHS hospital (Northallerton, Peterborough, Frimley Park, Derriford, Portsmouth, Selly Oak) but miltary consultants do work in other NHS hospitals as well. You will treat both miltary and civilian patients and work alongside NHS colleagues, so you'll get pretty much the same breadth and depth of training and experience. The difference is you'll get detached for short periods to field hospitals overseas (Basra, Kandahar, Bastion etc). In fact, I don't think there are any purely miltary hospitals left (apart, I think from the small RAF hospital in Cyprus) so as a seconndary care specialist you should basically expect to work in an NHS hospital, but be employed by the military. If you choose to go the GP route, you will do your hospital time as above, then your GP training in a military GP training practice. These training practices treat families as well as serving personnel to enable GP registrars to gain the broad experience necessary. Although your exposure to elderly patients may still be limited as a military GP, many do leave each year and transfer seamlessly into partnerships or salaried GP posts in the NHS. You can also sometimes do out-of-hours cooperative work if you want to keep your hand in with a broad range of civilian patients.

Other benefits of the miltary are probably the social life, good (free) training, job security, cheap accommodation, opportunities for sport and adventure training etc.

Whether the many pros outweigh the big cons of the military depends on you as an individual, and it's quite a personal decision.

[chris5656]

Thanks for the info Rifraf. How do you know so much about it?

Also, those salaries you mention are higher than the advertised ones on the RAF website.

[Riffraf]

Chris, the clue's in the avatar! You are right, the RAF careers website figures don't seem right but I think they quote the lowest figure... Hardly great advertising!

The army website has accurate salary figures for 2008, and the RN and RAF are the same:

Cadet Salary Rates

Medical Officers Salary Rates

[chris5656]

Originally Posted by Riffraf

Chris, the clue's in the avatar! You are right, the RAF careers website figures don't seem right but I think they quote the lowest figure... Hardly great advertising!

Ahh yes, and there is also a small clue in your name!

It is quite tempting. The money at med school. The not having to spend your whole career around elderly people. The going to different parts of the world. The social life.

I would still have to pass their officer course and aptitude tests though wouldnt I?

I have always been interested in defence issues too.

[Kohl]

Is it financially beneficial to sign up early and then quit after doing say one year's worth of service..?

If it is, I can imagine a lot of people going down that path.