If you could do it all again...would you?

[splatman007]

As the title suggests...

When I read the horror stories in the papers, speak to disheartened finalists and FY2s, and listen to consultants advising me to leave the NHS to become a banker/lawyer - I often wonder why I am still slogging it out in my 5th year? Will things improve by the time I start work in 2009? Doubt it...

I went through my "I-hate-medicine" phase after pre-clinicals where I was determined that medicine was crap I wanted to be a lawyer - especially when I saw my friends receiving offers from investment banks and law firms. To put it in perspective, one of them, aged 22, earned £97,000 (albeit incl bonus). Most ranged between £35k and £60k. Not bad when you are 21/22.

But I've passed that phase, loved my clinical years, know exactly why I am a medic. Now I'm not saying that doctors need to earn that sort of dosh but a job would be nice - salaries for 6 years at medical schools have never been great but with the abolition of free accommodation for FY1s, how the hell does one make a living?

People will argue and say that I sound very money minded, but I am being realistic and as a Londoner, now thinking more long term, realise the importance of saving and investing for the future. They often say that we are in the top 1-2% of the country - and yet the government treat us like s***!

One of the best young doctors I have ever met, a fact supported by the consultant of my firm, was an F1 when I was in 3rd year. I met him recently again - he wanted a surgical job, had no luck, and is currently on a FTSTA in A&E until the middle of this month before he is officially queuing with Eastern Europe's finest plumbers(!) (who these days can earn comparable money to senior registrars - tax free of course.) He is planning to quit citing Dubai/NZ as possible destinations. Failing that, he is off to law school.

If you could go back as a fresh faced, full of hope seventeen/eighteen year old with the insight that you now have, would you go back and do it all again?

In my case, I think about it and I know that a medical degree is supposed to be marketable, but what exactly can one do? I don't have a cut throat ruthless streak to work in the City. Our style of thinking - altruistic in nature - doesn't prepare us for a life elsewhere from medicine - but for many, that is sadly a very realistic and likely outcome.

[dragonXhunter]

Gosh splatman wen u put it dat way u make me wanna call up UCAS n switch to LAW. is it really dat bad? i kno ther r more doctors than jobs but still surely it aint that grim and desperate.

[rjm]

Simple answer...yes! As an F2, albeit one that has a job offer for run-through training so possibly less disheartened than others, there has only been 4 months of my career that i havent enjoyed, and that was because I was doing an F2 placement in a "specialty" that I really didnt like, but I knew there was an end to it. Most of the time I love my job, the hospital is like my second home, I like going to work (apart from sometimes on sundays!) and I wouldnt consider doing anything else. I would have gone abroad to do medicine rather than change career. Yes the pay is not great, as an F2, my current take home pay is £1440/month, of which more than half goes on my mortgage, but surely job satisfaction should be considered above that. I've chosen a specialty which even as a consultant I'll be hands on on the wards, on-calls chances are I will be at the hospital type thing, yet will be paid less than your average GP that doesnt do any out of hours (currently, all things set to change), but when you like what you do, to me that is more important. Unfortunately, your job as a medic forms such a big part of your life that if you are unhappy it totally screws you up, and no matter how much you'd pay me I now know I wouldnt do a job just for the money. But maybewhen I have kids etc my opinions will change.


I dont understand this medicine vs law thing that so many people go on about, they are two totally different jobs, and i dont see many similarities between them apart from they are both respected white collar jobs that you need to be reasonably intelligent to do. It seems to me that people who cant decide whether they want to be a doctor or a lawyer just do it for either the money or for the job respect, not because they are particularly interested in either career. But thats just my view. There are plenty of other things that you can do with a medical degree, and I do know people that have left medicine to work in the city, but I guess you have to be pretty business minded to start with.

[Singh.Simran]

I think you can draw good comparisons between medicine and law. Typically, someone good at one will be good at the other, and they require a lot of the same skills; assimilation and communication of knowledge, team/individual working, independant research, what have you.

I don't see any job as a "vocation" and people who think they have a calling are misguided and often the first to get jaded. So there's nothing wrong with liking more than one avenue and just picking one logically, like nearly everyone does.

After all, law is damm appealing.

[rjm]

Hate to say it but these "generic skills" that you refer to as being commonplace between medicine and law are actually common to most jobs, even shelf stacking in tescos.

[Gizmo says -]

Originally Posted by rjm

Hate to say it but these "generic skills" that you refer to as being commonplace between medicine and law are actually common to most jobs, even shelf stacking in tescos.

except you get paid more at tescos than 'studying' medicine.
and you probably get more of those kind of skills at tescos too.

[Singh.Simran]

Originally Posted by rjm

Hate to say it but these "generic skills" that you refer to as being commonplace between medicine and law are actually common to most jobs, even shelf stacking in tescos.

Perhaps true. But its the amount that differs.

Unless you suggest that you need the same degree of those skills for tescos and surgery?

If anything it supports my point that few jobs have unique skills so there's no reason not to consider them all if you have those skills. yes also in theory shelf-stacking but in reality it doesnt pay enough and has little to no career progression.

[Gizmo says -]

nuffing wrong wif your point, Simmy, but i fink he means the shared skills common to many jobs.

mind you, i stacked shelves in tescos and a newsagency once and i wuldnt say its affected the progression of any of ma careers. i wuld say the money earned from sales work allowed me to work in admin and then IT, and then apply for further education.

[yazoo]

Originally Posted by rjm

Simple answer...yes! As an F2, albeit one that has a job offer for run-through training so possibly less disheartened than others, there has only been 4 months of my career that i havent enjoyed, and that was because I was doing an F2 placement in a "specialty" that I really didnt like, but I knew there was an end to it. .

I'm not so lucky -I'm an FY2 still in the middle of job applications. But my answer is YES! I would do it all again.

I know what I want to do. I will get there. A bit of determination is sometimes required in life. If I don't get there, after years of trying (not just this year, and it may involve a move abroad) - well - at least I will know I have tried. And that is important in life.

[yazoo]

Originally Posted by Singh.Simran

I think you can draw good comparisons between medicine and law. Typically, someone good at one will be good at the other, and they require a lot of the same skills; assimilation and communication of knowledge, team/individual working, independant research, what have you.

I don't see any job as a "vocation" and people who think they have a calling are misguided and often the first to get jaded. So there's nothing wrong with liking more than one avenue and just picking one logically, like nearly everyone does.

After all, law is damm appealing.

If you find law appealing, go and do it. If you are sitting on the fence, please do not study/continue in medicine. There are already enough people in medicine like this and it is they who are unhappy (along with those stressed about jobs). Not the people with passion and a vocation. They are the satisfied ones. The ones who have a maintained motivation to remain in medicine long after they get their consultant posts.

On the subject of vocation and medicine, I could really not disagree more...