Physician assistants

[heed]

was on the RCoA website and came across their joint statement with the AAGBI regarding Physician Assistants in Anaesthesia. If its supposed to be a time saving and not a cost saving (aye right) exercise then I dont see how they will be of any use in anaesthetics.

the patient needs to be pre-assessed by an anaesthetist, then a consultant has to supervise the anaesthetic, the emergence from anaesthesia, and then give the handover. that same consultant has to be present in the theatre suite and available at all times to respond within 2 minutes to the PA in the event that they experience difficulties (so that consultant cannot have his or her own patient on the table unless he is doubled up).

the PA is also not allowed to undertake obstetric, paeds or trauma/emergency anaesthesia or resuscitation.

so, basically these people are going to be babysitting the patient as long as everything is going to plan. how is that any help?

[Spencer Wells]

Originally Posted by heed

so, basically these people are going to be babysitting the patient as long as everything is going to plan. how is that any help?

Especially given that that's already the SHO's job.

[elz]

well think how long it takes for someone to train to be an anaesthetist.
i dont really get what they'll do in A and E either,
it just seems to be more work for the doctor and someone else u hav to check on.
its like at work at the mo we have new people and i dont mind teaching them, but i dont get paid for it and its not part of my role and to be honest id rather just have double the work load and do it all on my own and get on with it, rather then having to double check someone else is doing in right.

i guess noone will really know how it will work until they get PAs in these places.

[Gizmo says -]

they are like 'eroes.


or are they Villains?

[Muffin2]

Originally Posted by heed

the patient needs to be pre-assessed by an anaesthetist, then a consultant has to supervise the anaesthetic, the emergence from anaesthesia, and then give the handover. that same consultant has to be present in the theatre suite and available at all times to respond within 2 minutes to the PA in the event that they experience difficulties (so that consultant cannot have his or her own patient on the table unless he is doubled up).

so, basically these people are going to be babysitting the patient as long as everything is going to plan. how is that any help?

thats ridiculous, how is any of that hepling anyone. anyone can see the idea of PA's is useless and just going to create more problems. a consultants time is better spent helping patients than watching over a PA. so am i to gather that patients will have longer to wait for surgery because the consultant can't operate at the same time as watching over a PA.

[heed]

no consultant should be responsible for more two patients if one of those patients is being cared for by a PA (if i remember correctly) according to the royal college. so basically, its cutting down training time for F2s and STs in Anaesthetics (and anywhere else where there are PAs) in order to provide a semi-anaesthetist. Having seen how quickly and spectacularly things can go arse over elbow in anaesthetics, there is not a snowballs chance in hell I would allow a PA to give me or anyone close to me an anaesthetic. sounds harsh but i think there are probably lots me like me in the medical world who are too scared of the PC brigade to say that PAs in an acute setting are a monumental waste of time and money which could be better spent developing the skills of proper doctors - not to mention a disaster waiting to happen.

[Muffin2]

oh yes i agree. like i said before in a previous thread. as soon as someone dies as a result, the idiots who came up with this hair brained idea will all realise what a bad idea it was. off course thats too late then.

[yazoo]

Interesting concept - has anyone done any market research on this? (Rhetorical - it's the NHS which acts with no foresight!). What happens if patients refuse to be anaesthetised by PAs? I would. What happens when Drs (like me) start to make comments like this. Is anyone aware of any jouralistic pieces on this? I bet the tabloids could have a field day. I hope they do. So what happens to the PAs then? Give me the gasman every time .

[Muffin2]

i'd refuse as well, and i'd encourage my friends and family to refuse as well. i don't want them getting harmed by a jobsworth.

[Dr Noodle]

Have they given any reason why they feel the need to create that new anaesthetist assistant position? Being just joe public I can't think of one single reason why they would need them considering jobless docs situation. I mean you guys (students and docs) have you been given any reasons at all?